The Elephant in the Room Part II

[Texzilla]

Yeah, because when we've had elite coaches we've done so poorly. 

100% of Arkansas' problems historically have come from poor coaching hires.  The one time in the SEC era that we got it right we were competing with everyone and a top 5-10 program.  ESPN, Jimmy Sexton, and the like have successfully perpetuated the notion that Arkansas makes good coaches bad, when the reality is that shitty coaches make Arkansas bad. 

I was being facetious.  The best recruiting we have for the program is Yuri, Muss and his wife, DVH, and the success in the minor sports. It's a great place to live and raise a family.  Sam was hired as he was affordable when we were paying off two buyouts (3? Were we paying Anderson too?) and based on what he did when he came I think he was a home run.  Choosing to come here and play with the garbage he was left with was a great story and the fact he wasn't a younger guy looking to win and leave helped as well.

If Sam leaves at the end of the season he can retire and be a local hero at the lake. Yuri likely has a nice list already just from fears Sam falls over dead on the sideline.  He is connected and I believe will be able to hire the right guy to come here and coach. 

[The Whyte Boar]

I was being facetious.  The best recruiting we have for the program is Yuri, Muss and his wife, DVH, and the success in the minor sports. It's a great place to live and raise a family.  Sam was hired as he was affordable when we were paying off two buyouts (3? Were we paying Anderson too?) and based on what he did when he came I think he was a home run.  Choosing to come here and play with the garbage he was left with was a great story and the fact he wasn't a younger guy looking to win and leave helped as well.

If Sam leaves at the end of the season he can retire and be a local hero at the lake. Yuri likely has a nice list already just from fears Sam falls over dead on the sideline.  He is connected and I believe will be able to hire the right guy to come here and coach. 

If Sam doesn't fuck it up.  And by that, I mean do so badly that people see it as a program limitation instead of coaching.

[Feral]

If Sam leaves at the end of the season he can retire and be a local hero at the lake. Yuri likely has a nice list already just from fears Sam falls over dead on the sideline.  He is connected and I believe will be able to hire the right guy to come here and coach. 

Let's just hope he doesn't shit the bed again like he did with Kiffin. I hate Jimmy Sexton with the fire of a thousand suns, but you still have to play his game when your nuts are in a vice.

I get that we were paying multiple buyouts at the time, but it's telling that that 2019 hire was existential for the football program and we ended up cutting pennies and thus wound up with a career OL coach.

[DirkPiggler]

I would say "No one is leaving Florida State, WHILE THEY ARE WINNING BIG, to come here..."  There is always the chance of hiring someone that washes out and they land here...that is the Arkansas way.

True.

If this were posted elsewhere someone would say "but Jimbo left FSU a couple of years after winning it all!"  Jimbo was one average to bad season, which was inevitable given the pile of shit roster he left behind in Tallahassee, from being unemployed.  Leave it to the Aggies to win a bidding war when their only competition is the unemployment line.

[DirkPiggler]

Let's just hope he doesn't shit the bed again like he did with Kiffin. I hate Jimmy Sexton with the fire of a thousand suns, but you still have to play his game when your nuts are in a vice.

I get that we were paying multiple buyouts at the time, but it's telling that that 2019 hire was existential for the football program and we ended up cutting pennies and thus wound up with a career OL coach.

Posted this on another board earlier in response to something similar. 

I don't think we were getting Kiffin regardless of whether or not we matched Ole Miss's offer.  Sean Tuohy and Jimmy Sexton decided over a full cow and four fried chickens for dinner one night that they were going to steal Lane away from us no matter what it took to make it happen.  Scumbag was going to make sure OM got the last look at our final offer no matter how many times we countered. 

[Show-Me Hog]

I know most woopiggers do not give two fucks about what others think about Arkansas football.

However, when it comes to making coaching firing and hiring decisions, I think Hunter and the administration have to think about that. Anyone we would want to hire, by definition comes from outside Arkansas football.

To the college football world that doesn't live and breathe Razorbacks, who is Sam Pittman? Even RIGHT NOW?? He's the success story of an aw shucks good ole boy offensive lineman coach who got his chance and turned around the Razorback program as a head coach. That's who he is. He's not a failure. He's not doing a bad job. He's a tremendous success. This is how he is seen in the eyes of the college football world.  The stink of last year and this year has not yet made it to the outside world, I guarandamntee you.

Does Hunter fire that guy?

[animal]

I know most woopiggers do not give two fucks about what others think about Arkansas football.

However, when it comes to making coaching firing and hiring decisions, I think Hunter and the administration have to think about that. Anyone we would want to hire, by definition comes from outside Arkansas football.

To the college football world that doesn't live and breathe Razorbacks, who is Sam Pittman? Even RIGHT NOW?? He's the success story of an aw shucks good ole boy offensive lineman coach who got his chance and turned around the Razorback program as a head coach. That's who he is. He's not a failure. He's not doing a bad job. He's a tremendous success. This is how he is seen in the eyes of the college football world.  The stink of last year and this year has not yet made it to the outside world, I guarandamntee you.

Does Hunter fire that guy?

Everything to me is conditional on what's happening with the team. Such as despite all the woes on the line I would still tend to think this is a 5 win team (somehow) and that's probably enough to give him a pass. Especially when you consider how young we really are on the offensive line depth. This is the new pitch by Adam ford and he's not wrong. We have two guys from the 2019 class, none from the 2020 class, barely anyone plays from the 2021 class. That leaves you with freshman and sophomores filling out your "depth" along with some transfers that haven't really panned out.

[The Whyte Boar]

Everything to me is conditional on what's happening with the team. Such as despite all the woes on the line I would still tend to think this is a 5 win team (somehow) and that's probably enough to give him a pass. Especially when you consider how young we really are on the offensive line depth. This is the new pitch by Adam ford and he's not wrong. We have two guys from the 2019 class, none from the 2020 class, barely anyone plays from the 2021 class. That leaves you with freshman and sophomores filling out your "depth" along with some transfers that haven't really panned out.

I don't think youth is much excuse since you really can't count on your young guys being there next year. 

[DRYANKNPULL]

I wanted Norvell and there is not much of a chance we could get him now. But we need to find someone like him. Somebody with HEAD coaching experience with a track record of winning, like going 38-15 at Memphis sort of winning. Somebody who is young, has an insane work ethic and is hungry to prove he can win in the SEC.

We don't need to hire somebody because it's his turn. Don't tout what limb of the coaching tree he fell off of. Don't give somebody in his late 50's an opportunity to fund a retirement. Find someone who is willing to do the work to win now. I never want to hear about trusting a process or building depth. That's fucking loser Bert talk.

[animal]

I don't think youth is much excuse since you really can't count on your young guys being there next year.   

As a program you still have to operate on the assumption that you can retain enough guys at each position group. As others have said and maybe I've made light of it but you can't simply expect SEC/FBS caliber lineman to fall in your lap out of the portal each year. Lineman are a premium so especially for O line you really need to raise them boys up and develop the shit out of them. For many of these guys it's too early in their careers to simply declare them busts. The guys that should be playing right now flopped or transferred away. St. John, Henderson, and Curry. They would be the older guys to go a long with Limmer and Latham. Doesn't mean they were good enough but that's why you have to have the numbers.

Remember when Bert had 17 tight ends on the roster? I mean yeah I'm being somewhat sarcastic but damn we had a bunch and none of them were worth a damn beyond Derby and Henry. I know that's history now but it just goes to show you that decisions made 5 to 6 years in the past could impact the current day even with the portal being a thing now. Mostly I think we shit the bed in some areas and that falls on this staff.


Enhancing a bit further
19/20 season
Dylan Rathcke (retired medically after a couple seasons)
*Limmer still playing
*Latham still playing
Stromberg (NFL)
Austin Nix (played a couple seasons, not sure what happened after)
with covid years I think we could still mathematically have had a shot at
Luke Jones (transferred in from Notre Dame)
Noah Gatlin
Wagner?


20/21

Marcus Henderson (now at Memphis)
Jalen St. John (UNLV)
Ray Curry Jr.  (alabama state)

21/22

Cole Carson
*Devon Manuel
Ty'Kieast Crawford  (transferred in from Charlotte)
Terry Wells

22/23
Eli Henderson
*Andrew Chamblee
*Patrick Kutas
E'Marion Harris

23/24

Joey Su'a
Amaury Wiggins (JUCO)
Paris Patterson
Luke Brown
*Joshua Braun (transferred in from Florida)

[Thin Red Swine]

I know most woopiggers do not give two fucks about what others think about Arkansas football.

However, when it comes to making coaching firing and hiring decisions, I think Hunter and the administration have to think about that. Anyone we would want to hire, by definition comes from outside Arkansas football.

To the college football world that doesn't live and breathe Razorbacks, who is Sam Pittman? Even RIGHT NOW?? He's the success story of an aw shucks good ole boy offensive lineman coach who got his chance and turned around the Razorback program as a head coach. That's who he is. He's not a failure. He's not doing a bad job. He's a tremendous success. This is how he is seen in the eyes of the college football world.  The stink of last year and this year has not yet made it to the outside world, I guarandamntee you.

Does Hunter fire that guy?

Most outsiders see only the win-loss record. Most of the positive recognition was two years ago when there was all the hype going into the Georgia curbstomping.

Those from afar will realize shortly, probably when they get to the bottom of the SEC standings in late November, he was probably just another flash in the pan who coined a funny slogan.

[Spiderham]

Looks like Sam is being paid about right to slightly overpaid.  10th highest in the SEC
Also, I didn't realize Mel Tucker just lost a $10 million-a-year gig.  WOW!

Highest paid public school coach salaries in 2023 via
@USAToday
in millions
1 Nick Saban, Bama $11.407
2 Dabo Swinney, Clemson $10.884
3 Kirby Smart, Georgia $10.705
4 Ryan Day, Ohio St $10.271
5 Mel Tucker, Mich St $10.015
6 Brian Kelly, LSU $9.975
7 Jimbo Fisher, A&M $9.150
8 Mark Stoops, Kentucky $9.013
9 Josh Huepel, Tennessee $9.000
(Tie) Lane Kiffin, Ole Miss $9.000
11 James Franklin, Penn St $8.500
12 Jim Harbaugh, Michigan $8.254
13 Luke Fickell, Wisconsin $7.625
(Tie) Mike Gundy, Okla St $7.625
15 Mike Norvell, Florida St $7.300
16 Billy Napier, Florida $7.270
17 Brent Venables, OU $7.100
18 Kirk Ferentz, Iowa $7.000
19 Dan Lanning, Oregon $6.624
20 Hugh Freeze, Auburn $6,500
(Tie) Bret Bielema, Illinois $6.500
22 Sam Pittman, Arkansas $6.357
23 Kyle Whittingham, Utah $6,325
24 Shane Beamer, South Carolina $6.125
25 Eliah Drinkwitz, Missouri $6.000
(Tie) P.J. Fleck, Minnesota $6.000

[DirkPiggler]

I wanted Norvell and there is not much of a chance we could get him now. But we need to find someone like him. Somebody with HEAD coaching experience with a track record of winning, like going 38-15 at Memphis sort of winning. Somebody who is young, has an insane work ethic and is hungry to prove he can win in the SEC.

We don't need to hire somebody because it's his turn. Don't tout what limb of the coaching tree he fell off of. Don't give somebody in his late 50's an opportunity to fund a retirement. Find someone who is willing to do the work to win now. I never want to hear about trusting a process or building depth. That's fucking loser Bert talk.

Norvell's biggest selling point to me wasn't his record.  At the time when we were able to get him, he was 18-8, which was good for Memphis but not elite (and a hell of a lot better than the doofus we ended up hiring, in the same league, at a lesser program, with ass stompings head to head, but I digress).  And the pro-dipshit faction liked to point out that he was following another successful coach there and still using a lot of that guy's players. 

What was obvious about him to me was his attention to detail.  WRs ran crisp routes.  Plays got in on time and correctly.  There were few stupid penalties...false starts, procedure, delay of game, etc.  And his special teams unit were as good as some of the Frank Beamer Va Tech squads.  Being detail oriented is the number one skill in a successful head coach, not recruiting, not strategy, not a cool cowboy hat and sunglasses (although Deion is supposedly a stickler for the little stuff as well).  We have had exactly one head coach who was good at making sure the small details were drilled into the players' heads so that they could execute without thinking.  Norvell would have made two, and likely would have had similar success to the other guy by now.

[buff2.0]

(and a hell of a lot better than the doofus we ended up hiring, in the same league, at a lesser program, with ass stompings head to head, but I digress). 

51-7 and 66-45 wins over Chad.  Of course, being Arkansas, we look at those two and hire the wrong one. 

[animal]

Starting with Ford we hired a known name who came with a decent amount of credibility at the time, then followed up with a folk hero yokel genius, then followed with another coach that was a name with loads of credibility, then Smile if you want to count him, then another name with credibility that brought us fat dough boys, then we were sold a fucking lemon and everyone pretended for a little bit that it was cherry pie, then we're back on yokel folk legend who has brought back fat dough boys.

[The Whyte Boar]

Is no one going to talk about the alleged student/Enos email exchange after Saturday's game?  I read an an article elaborately debunking and claiming it must be false, but the university has declined to comment on it and deny it.  So,that tells me it is probably real.
https://www.si.com/college/arkansas/hogs-football/razorbacks-pittman-enos-twitter-sec-texas-aggies-student-email-1

Most of the things the article mentions like lack of e-sig and all that could be answered by the fact that if it was actually Enos, he was probably using his phone instead of a work computer to respond.  My e-sig won't show up if I reply with my phone and using my phone means my emails sometimes are more informal and use some of the shorthand I use in texts.

[Lurk]

Is no one going to talk about the alleged student/Enos email exchange after Saturday's game?  I read an an article elaborately debunking and claiming it must be false, but the university has declined to comment on it and deny it.  So,that tells me it is probably real.
https://www.si.com/college/arkansas/hogs-football/razorbacks-pittman-enos-twitter-sec-texas-aggies-student-email-1

Most of the things the article mentions like lack of e-sig and all that could be answered by the fact that if it was actually Enos, he was probably using his phone instead of a work computer to respond.  My e-sig won't show up if I reply with my phone and using my phone means my emails sometimes are more informal and use some of the shorthand I use in texts.

Even if he did, that was about as mild a response as you could possibly have. Why is this even a story? I hate social media

[Thin Red Swine]

Is no one going to talk about the alleged student/Enos email exchange after Saturday's game?  I read an an article elaborately debunking and claiming it must be false, but the university has declined to comment on it and deny it.  So,that tells me it is probably real.
https://www.si.com/college/arkansas/hogs-football/razorbacks-pittman-enos-twitter-sec-texas-aggies-student-email-1

Most of the things the article mentions like lack of e-sig and all that could be answered by the fact that if it was actually Enos, he was probably using his phone instead of a work computer to respond.  My e-sig won't show up if I reply with my phone and using my phone means my emails sometimes are more informal and use some of the shorthand I use in texts.

Shirley you don't believe it's real.

"Sorry, Coach Pittman. I can't make the team plane flight. I've got some emails I've GOT to get answered."

[Spiderham]

Shirley you don't believe it's real.

"Sorry, Coach Pittman. I can't make the team plane flight. I've got some emails I've GOT to get answered."

"Someone on the internet is mad about our shotgun 4th down plays.  I MUST answer this right now!"

[HogOfWar]

Starting with Ford we hired a known name who came with a decent amount of credibility at the time, then followed up with a folk hero yokel genius, then followed with another coach that was a name with loads of credibility, then Smile if you want to count him, then another name with credibility that brought us fat dough boys, then we were sold a fucking lemon and everyone pretended for a little bit that it was cherry pie, then we're back on yokel folk legend who has brought back fat dough boys.

So, we are due for someone with good credentials.