Coaching Hot Seat and Searches

[DirkPiggler]

Of course you are 100% right.  I'm simply a crotchety old man saying "GET OFF MY LAWN" with this entire thing.  I don't think I'll ever be able to change with the times on where college athletics is going.

I get it, and feel the same way.  Don't like where the sport has gone at all.  The newest model, with revenue sharing AND NIL is even worse.  Advocates for players being paid always used the argument that doing so would end cheating.  That's completely antithetical to economic reality.  Someone is always going to work outside the framework to get an edge.  The market will still direct players to the highest bidder, legal (within the rules) or otherwise.

[Texzilla]

If we go back a few seasons, it looked like nil was going to be linemen getting a free chopped beef sandwich and a drink at wrights bbq every week.  Paying players was to give them a small slice of the fortunes amassed by the schools.

Instead the mess we got created competition from schools, the collectives, and the foundations. All with their handouts.  With a portal chaser that enables players to move at will.  I'd like to see the sec produce a standard contract that goes with the letter.  That dictates term of service.

[jdcatty]

If we go back a few seasons, it looked like nil was going to be linemen getting a free chopped beef sandwich and a drink at wrights bbq every week.  Paying players was to give them a small slice of the fortunes amassed by the schools.

Instead the mess we got created competition from schools, the collectives, and the foundations. All with their handouts.  With a portal chaser that enables players to move at will.  I'd like to see the sec produce a standard contract that goes with the letter.  That dictates term of service.

Some standardization in the SEC would be a start, but of course then the players could just jump to another conference.  Until they come up with some way to actually make the players abide by the rules across all of college football, we will have turmoil.  The way they do it in the NFL is through the collective bargaining agreement with the player's union.  Something similar might work in the major college world.

[DirkPiggler]

Some standardization in the SEC would be a start, but of course then the players could just jump to another conference.  Until they come up with some way to actually make the players abide by the rules across all of college football, we will have turmoil.  The way they do it in the NFL is through the collective bargaining agreement with the player's union.  Something similar might work in the major college world.

Collective bargaining would certainly help, as would significant punishment for violators. 

The one thing in the "can't pay players" era that was never really tried, the thing that could have shut down illegal payments faster than anything, would have been to put it all on the head coaches instead of insulating them by punishing assistants.  Make the head coaches responsible for any rules violations at their schools, with a ten year ban on working in the sport and no buyout payments allowed.

Does anyone really believe that Nick Saban didn't control every aspect of what his underlings were doing?  If he had an assistant paying players you can damn well know that Nick knew about it.  And by the same token you know he would have gotten a handle on boosters paying players if it meant he was about to lose his job and the ability to earn millions doing it - not just at Alabama but anywhere in CFB - if someone representing his school got caught breaking rules.  I'm just using Saban as an example...use any major coach you like in his place. 

[The Whyte Boar]

Entirely foreseeable.  In fact, it happened before in the 1920s and was why the NCAA came into being and was so draconian in its interpretation of the rules.  They knew that once the dam broke on paying players and amateur status it was Katy bar the door and we would be where we are in short order.

[DRYANKNPULL]

This is why the closed, semi-monopolistic professional sports model -- revenue sharing, salary caps, trade (transfer) restrictions, communistic access to talent (draft in reverse order), contracts, tampering rules -- is the only way to maintain competition in a professional sports league.

College football and basketball are a bastard child in between amateurism and professional management right now. It's untenable and who knows how long it will take to get there.

Exactly right. The question is who's first and what does it look like?  Some school is going to get caught in a cascade of: stadium expansion, coach buyouts, our team sucks and no ticket sales, economic slowdown.  The next step is they can't make a payment. It's going to happen.

[Third_down_draw]

Exactly right. The question is who's first and what does it look like?  Some school is going to get caught in a cascade of: stadium expansion, coach buyouts, our team sucks and no ticket sales, economic slowdown.  The next step is they can't make a payment. It's going to happen.

Great - a bailout to pay Sexton & Co.   

[pigtacular]

Titans fired Brian Callahan

[DRYANKNPULL]

Great - a bailout to pay Sexton & Co. 

And he (and all of the lawyers) still make money after the bailout because they get to do it all over again. The fix is in on all of this. The only way to stay competitive is to pay college football players exorbitant amounts of money and the only way to make that work is to have enough senior citizens willing to pledge $10 a month.

[animal]

Titans fired Brian Callahan

He is a chip off the old block. I guess maybe the Bengals can take him back and fix Joe Burrow next off season 

Titans are about as trash as the Jets.

[dhog]

He is a chip off the old block. I guess maybe the Bengals can take him back and fix Joe Burrow next off season

Titans are about as trash as the Jets.

Speaking of the Jets, what did they see in Justin Fields that made them say, "he's our QB". Dude can't pull the trigger on a pass under 5 seconds to save his life. Of course yesterday he was on his ass most of the time in about 3 seconds.

[animal]

Speaking of the Jets, what did they see in Justin Fields that made them say, "he's our QB". Dude can't pull the trigger on a pass under 5 seconds to save his life. Of course yesterday he was on his ass most of the time in about 3 seconds.

He did ok ish with the Steelers 

[Texzilla]

Collective bargaining would certainly help, as would significant punishment for violators. 

The one thing in the "can't pay players" era that was never really tried, the thing that could have shut down illegal payments faster than anything, would have been to put it all on the head coaches instead of insulating them by punishing assistants.  Make the head coaches responsible for any rules violations at their schools, with a ten year ban on working in the sport and no buyout payments allowed.

Does anyone really believe that Nick Saban didn't control every aspect of what his underlings were doing?  If he had an assistant paying players you can damn well know that Nick knew about it.  And by the same token you know he would have gotten a handle on boosters paying players if it meant he was about to lose his job and the ability to earn millions doing it - not just at Alabama but anywhere in CFB - if someone representing his school got caught breaking rules.  I'm just using Saban as an example...use any major coach you like in his place. 

How do you have collective bargaining when they aren't employees of anyone?  To do that it's time to just do away with the ruse of "student athletes" and make them 1099 contracted employees. Let them go to class or give them vouchers for after football.  They can have a union.  A salary cap.  Strict penalties for stupid boosters. Let them play from 18 til whenever the coach cuts them. 

[animal]

How do you have collective bargaining when they aren't employees of anyone?  To do that it's time to just do away with the ruse of "student athletes" and make them 1099 contracted employees. Let them go to class or give them vouchers for after football.  They can have a union.  A salary cap.  Strict penalties for stupid boosters. Let them play from 18 til whenever the coach cuts them. 

From the federal definition it could be argued that they are indeed employees 


They don't provide their own equipment 
They are told when and where to be
They are expected to uphold some measure of representation in a positive light their school 
They are paid

[BleedinRed]

At best they are contract workers.  How do you force collective barganing on contract workers?

[DirkPiggler]

At best they are contract workers.  How do you force collective barganing on contract workers?

Ask the electricians, plumbers, etc. 

[BleedinRed]

Ask the electricians, plumbers, etc. 

A quick google said the following (which is gospel I'm sure):

Question - "Are contract workers subject to collective bargaining agreement in private industry"

Answer - "No, generally contract workers are not subject to a collective bargaining agreement (CBA) because most are classified as independent contractors who lack the right to bargain collectively under the National Labor Relations Act (NLRA). However, some contract workers on government projects may be covered by a specific labor agreement that dictates their pay and benefits, such as the Service Contract Act. "

"Independent contractor status: The NLRA, which governs collective bargaining in the private sector, explicitly excludes independent contractors from its protections. Since contract workers are considered their own bosses rather than traditional employees, they do not have collective bargaining rights."

"Exclusion from federal law: The NLRA excludes a broad category of workers, including independent contractors, agricultural workers, and domestic workers, from the right to organize and bargain."

"Service Contract Act (SCA): For service contracts with the federal government, the SCA requires that service employees be paid at least the prevailing wage and fringe benefits. If the predecessor contractor had a CBA, the successor contractor must pay the contract workers at least the rate established in that agreement for the first year, even if the new contractor's employees were not previously employed by the predecessor."

"Project Labor Agreements (PLAs): The federal government can also require a PLA on specific construction projects, which can cover contract workers on that particular job."

[BleedinRed]

After futher googling I think the players are employees and should be able to bargain collectively.  Seems the NLRB agrees - at least they did back in 2021 when they issued an opion stating as much.

[DirkPiggler]

After futher googling I think the players are employees and should be able to bargain collectively.  Seems the NLRB agrees - at least they did back in 2021 when they issued an opion stating as much.

They meet the definition of employees that the rest of us have to follow.

The powers that be in college athletics have been pushing for an antitrust exemption.  I think part of that is to prevent players from being classified as employees. 

Can you imagine the workmen's comp premiums that universities would have to pay on football players?

[BleedinRed]

Didn't even think about the insurance side of that equation.  Wow.