Fayette Villains…In Depth Analysis

[vegashog]

Sam was sold to us as this good ol' boy, loves the helmet, no need to negotiate guy with a hometown agent.  As soon as he had a decent season he kicked that agent, who went a long way towards getting him the job in the first place, to the curb for a scumbag with a history of fücking over Arkansas and shitting on us to his clients at every opportunity. 

I'm all for making as much money for yourself as the market will bear, but don't hold yourself out to be something different or uniquely loyal in the process. 

maybe don't put much stock in coach speak or what the university had to say to justify a risky hire?

the writers and coaches picked arkansas fifth - in the west. vegas had the win total between 5.5-6.5. yet i read  how this should be a 9 or 10 win team or "but pittman said...". it still could be a good season, but nobody outside of razorback fans was expecting much out of this group. and for the record i enjoy reading his column.

...I think if you've watched much of KJ Jefferson and Arkansas football over the last 20 years you'll note that we tend to have one or two players that do freak shit and that's how we score. That's it...that's the game plan. You can only analyze the shit out of that so much before it just doesn't make sense....

yeah, i wonder if he was around when matt jones was doing matt jones things, lol.

[Feral]

the writers and coaches picked arkansas fifth - in the west. vegas had the win total between 5.5-6.5. yet i read  how this should be a 9 or 10 win team or "but pittman said...". it still could be a good season, but nobody outside of razorback fans was expecting much out of this group. and for the record i enjoy reading his column.

This is very true.

I feel like we all talked ourselves into Arkansas having this great season because of KJ, the RB rotation, the guys we pulled out of the portal, and overhauling our defense (which literally couldn't be worse than last year). We ignored the fact that our offensive line was a huge question mark, and our defensive line has been overhyped and underwhelming for over a decade now.

When Vegas set our win total around that 6 game mark, I knew we'd probably be in for disappointment when we were throwing around 9-3 and 8-4 expectations. Sadly, it looks like Vegas might have it pegged perfectly. As my father in law often says, they don't build those fancy casinos because they lose.

[DirkPiggler]

maybe don't put much stock in coach speak or what the university had to say to justify a risky hire?

the writers and coaches picked arkansas fifth - in the west. vegas had the win total between 5.5-6.5. yet i read  how this should be a 9 or 10 win team or "but pittman said...". it still could be a good season, but nobody outside of razorback fans was expecting much out of this group. and for the record i enjoy reading his column.
yeah, i wonder if he was around when matt jones was doing matt jones things, lol.

Not sure how what you quoted applies to what I said other than maybe the first sentence, but okay I guess.

Regardless of coach speak, he did use a bunch of Arkansas connections to move his way into consideration for a job his resume didn't qualify him to have, and he has on more than one occasion professed gratitude, loyalty and all the other bullshit we heard from another mediocre coach far too often.  Joke's on us for taking him literally. 

It's like how Nutt and Petrino's infidelities should have been taken differently.  Petrino never sold himself as anything but a football coach, so his personal life shouldn't have mattered (just talking about the act of the affair here - not getting into the weeds with the implications of who it was with).  Nutt kept his job in large part because of the "fine Christian man" persona.  His personal failures were fair game because they contradicted the image he cultivated in order to gain support in lieu of a good record. 

The same applies with Sam versus another coach like Musselman for example.  If you're using loyalty to preserve your job or make the path easier, you make yourself fair game when you do something that contradicts everything you've said.  If you're standing or falling on your record alone then the act of contract machinations or using a known enemy of the program to do your bidding isn't as big of a deal.

[DRYANKNPULL]

Sam was sold to us as this good ol' boy, loves the helmet, no need to negotiate guy with a hometown agent.   As soon as he had a decent season he kicked that agent, who went a long way towards getting him the job in the first place, to the curb for a scumbag with a history of fücking over Arkansas and shitting on us to his clients at every opportunity. 

I'm all for making as much money for yourself as the market will bear, but don't hold yourself out to be something different or uniquely loyal in the process. 

I'll never understand how the negotiations work. Sam stopped the bleeding from Chad to get us back to Bert levels and was paid millions to do it. Why couldn't we just tell Sexton that 3-5 in the SEC isn't a reward situation? Keep the pay the same and write a check for $1 mill for a BCS bowl win. Would Sam have been pissed and bolted for Notre Dame?

[DirkPiggler]

I'll never understand how the negotiations work. Sam stopped the bleeding from Chad to get us back to Bert levels and was paid millions to do it. Why couldn't we just tell Sexton that 3-5 in the SEC isn't a reward situation? Keep the pay the same and write a check for $1 mill for a BCS bowl win. Would Sam have been pissed and bolted for Notre Dame?

It's all part of the Sexton game.  If you don't treat his clients "fairly" in his eyes, he steers the rest of them away from you the next time you have a search.  He did it when we fired his least employable client at the time (Nutt) and again with his even worse client (Morris). 

Some say that I'm unfair to Sexton, that he's just looking out for his clients' best interest, and that may be true in his mind.  A couple of points on that...one, if you make sure we get only the dregs of your coaching stable, the prophecy of "you can't win at Arkansas" becomes self-fulfilling and easier to sell to the rest of your client group.  And if working in your clients' best interest, even if well-intentioned, works to actively harm our program, you are an enemy and should be dealt with harshly if we ever get the opportunity.  It is not our responsibility to make sure that the coaching market is compensated at or above market value. 

[Feral]

I'll never understand how the negotiations work. Sam stopped the bleeding from Chad to get us back to Bert levels and was paid millions to do it. Why couldn't we just tell Sexton that 3-5 in the SEC isn't a reward situation? Keep the pay the same and write a check for $1 mill for a BCS bowl win. Would Sam have been pissed and bolted for Notre Dame?

Yurachek got fleeced in those negotiations, just as Long did when he gave Bert the big raise and extension after 2014.

Pittman had 1 good year, and at that point was 7-11 in conference play (Bert was 2-14). He had previously been outspoken about not wanting to be anywhere else, and no one else really wanted him. It wasn't in any way akin to the Kiffin situation where Ole Miss had to pay him as a defensive move.

The Kiffin and Mel Tucker deals prove that the economics of college football coaching contracts are broken. Basically you sign a big contract, you have one good year or someone else shows interest in you (the Sexton special), and then you sign an even bigger contract.

[BleedinRed]

When is the last time an Arkansas football coach didn't get what he wanted financially so he moved on to another program?  I think its time we start rewarding success rather than failure.  What is the worst that happens?  We go winless in the SEC?  We lose to North Texas and BYU?

[hit_that_line]

Sam is the 12th highest paid coach in the league. Billy Napier is making $7.4 lol. College sports are so broken.

[DirkPiggler]

When is the last time an Arkansas football coach didn't get what he wanted financially so he moved on to another program?  I think its time we start rewarding success rather than failure.  What is the worst that happens?  We go winless in the SEC?  We lose to North Texas and BYU?

Bowden Wyatt in 1954?  Jack Mitchell right after him in 1957? 

I guess you could say Hatfield, but that had nothing to do with finances.

It would be nice to be in a position where we had to worry about someone trying to steal away a successful football coach.

[HogOfWar]

I'll never understand how the negotiations work. Sam stopped the bleeding from Chad to get us back to Bert levels and was paid millions to do it. Why couldn't we just tell Sexton that 3-5 in the SEC isn't a reward situation? Keep the pay the same and write a check for $1 mill for a BCS bowl win. Would Sam have been pissed and bolted for Notre Dame?

It's all part of the Sexton game.  If you don't treat his clients "fairly" in his eyes, he steers the rest of them away from you the next time you have a search.  He did it when we fired his least employable client at the time (Nutt) and again with his even worse client (Morris). 

Some say that I'm unfair to Sexton, that he's just looking out for his clients' best interest, and that may be true in his mind.  A couple of points on that...one, if you make sure we get only the dregs of your coaching stable, the prophecy of "you can't win at Arkansas" becomes self-fulfilling and easier to sell to the rest of your client group.  And if working in your clients' best interest, even if well-intentioned, works to actively harm our program, you are an enemy and should be dealt with harshly if we ever get the opportunity.  It is not our responsibility to make sure that the coaching market is compensated at or above market value. 

Again, we need our own agent, or someone competent that won't blink when Sexton or another coach's agent starts these games.

[vegashog]

Sam is the 12th highest paid coach in the league. Billy Napier is making $7.4 lol. College sports are so broken.

and kiffin gets $9 million.

and while you may bitch about the $5 million per year sam is getting, the buyout is extremely good for the university. not only does it go down every year, but it's also dependent on his winning percentage at that time. rare for contracts today.

the market has been set and the people to blame are the folks on this board and the rest of americans who have an insane passion/obsession with sports, particularly football *vegashog raises his hand*, not agents or the coaches.

[DirkPiggler]

and kiffin gets $9 million.

and while you may bitch about the $5 million per year sam is getting, the buyout is extremely good for the university. not only does it go down every year, but it's also dependent on his winning percentage at that time. rare for contracts today.

the market has been set and the people to blame are the folks on this board and the rest of americans who have an insane passion/obsession with sports, particularly football *vegashog raises his hand*, not agents or the coaches.

I don't particularly care how much our (or anyone's) coaches are paid, or how much we pay them to go away provided the amount doesn't prevent us from paying market value to that guy's replacement.  And you're absolutely right as to who is to blame. 

My beef with Sexton is the way he treats us specifically in the process, namely the advice he gives to his clients when we have an opening.  I have heard from his lips a version of "you can't win there", at an event held in this state, so I have little doubt that he's telling this in more blunt terms to his clients. 

All agents do some shady shit to help their clients.  Remember Bert's supposed offer to head coach the Denver Broncos off a 7-6 year here?  As far as we know Sexton is the only one who has actively tried to steer interested clients away from our program. 

[BleedinRed]

I don't have an issue with Pittman's salary.  You don't take advantage of a guy because you know he isn't interested (or can't) go elsewhere.  We are paying him on the low side of the SEC coaching salary scale.  I also think the comments on his weight are juvenile but that is a different conversation for another day.

Pitt is a weird situation for me to wrap my head around.  

With Nutt, after year 5 you could see he would never get over the hump.  He was a 7 or 8 win a year guy and after 10 years it was apparent it was time to move on.  We waited probably 4 years too long.

Chad just sucked from the beginning.  He was never going to be a good head coach.  

Brett came in with some success that we could point to and be excited.  I wasn't excited by the hire but I could see the appeal.  Quickly you could see his approach was not going to be successful.  

Petrino, every year we got better.  I don't know what would have happened but no one can deny that from year 1 to year 4 we had improved greatly and were continuing to get better.

Then there is Sam.  He has tried hiring good people.  He lets the coordinators do coordinating things.  He isn't a used car salesman.  But, we are at best marginally better today than when he took over 4 years ago.  We are not disciplined.  We are not overly tough.  Yet, I am not ready to give up on him.  Maybe because he is a genuinely nice guy.  I don't know. 

I do know this though, he is in that danger zone of either produce and be loved forever, step aside and be appreciated forever,  OR lose, hang on, and have everyone hate you.  

[Snorts]

Bowden Wyatt in 1954?  Jack Mitchell right after him in 1957? 

I guess you could say Hatfield, but that had nothing to do with finances.

It would be nice to be in a position where we had to worry about someone trying to steal away a successful football coach.

No problems at all with this.  But just to add...I heard from a reliable source that Hatfield and Broyles were not on good terms after Broyles demanded Hatfield fire some assistants and Hatfield, to his everlasting credit, refused.  Hatfield also deeply resented Broyles interfering in his coaching decisions.  Apparently after a last play loss to Texass Broyles quizzed Hatfield about LB depth immediately following the game.

When Hatfield's contract came up, Broyles kept nit-picking him with B.S. to the point Hatfield picked up the phone, called Clemson (who had just fired their National Championship-winning coach Danny Ford), inquired about the job, and was hired without an interview.

Edit:  Hatfield was also miffed about Broyles signing a new 5 year contract, while at the same time fucking with his (Hatfield's).

So, I guess money wasn't the main reason Hatfield left, but was part of the problem.

[DirkPiggler]

No problems at all with this.  But just to add...I heard from a reliable source that Hatfield and Broyles were not on good terms after Broyles demanded Hatfield fire some assistants and Hatfield, to his everlasting credit, refused.  Hatfield also deeply resented Broyles interfering in his coaching decisions.  Apparently after a last play loss to Texass Broyles quizzed Hatfield about LB depth immediately following the game.

When Hatfield's contract came up, Broyles kept nit-picking him with B.S. to the point Hatfield picked up the phone, called Clemson (who had just fired their National Championship-winning coach Danny Ford), inquired about the job, and was hired without an interview.

Edit:  Hatfield was also miffed about Broyles signing a new 5 year contract, while at the same time fucking with his (Hatfield's).

So, I guess money wasn't the main reason Hatfield left, but was part of the problem.

Oh yeah, Hatfield left primarily because of the meddling and other micromanagement from Broyles.  Ken supposedly had a contract with basically the contract terms he had requested on his desk when he left for Clemson.

Ken thought he had the Georgia job the year before that.  Vince Dooley wanted to hire him, but the UGA boosters didn't like the idea of the wishbone.  Our players knew about it before the Cotton Bowl, which was a big reason behind the lackluster effort against UCLA.

The saddest thing about all this is that most everyone nationally considered both Clemson and Georgia to be lateral moves from Arkansas at the time.  My how we have fallen. 

[HOGSRUNWILD]

Let's be real.  Based on what we have seen, we SHOULD be 3-1 at WORST.  That isn't being a homer or going on preseason, that is going on what we have seen on the field.  There is zero, and I mean zero, excuse for losing to a mediocre BYU team at home.

LSU, they weren't really better than we were.  We didn't hang with them because of fluke plays.  We were as good as they were and lost because of our own mistakes.  It happens.

3-1 with a very good shot at 4-0 with clean, well-coached play.  Instead, we are 2-2.  Anyone saying we are where we should be with the players we have is simply lying.  We have underachieved so far this year.

[hit_that_line]

If we had beaten BYU, everyone would be feeling okay right now. Just an inexcusable loss.

[DirkPiggler]

If we had beaten BYU, everyone would be feeling okay right now. Just an inexcusable loss.

No doubt. 

Had we won that one we were destined to be ranked at the bottom of the polls.  A last-second three point loss at LSU, at night, wouldn't have dropped us out. 

On the bright side, Aggy and Ole Miss look more winnable than they did in the preseason.  Which means we'll probably go 0-2. 

[hit_that_line]

Supposedly A&M struggles to generate pass rush. I like the Moss running back for them a lot. Gonna have to shut down their run.

[DirkPiggler]

Supposedly A&M struggles to generate pass rush. I like the Moss running back for them a lot. Gonna have to shut down their run.

We're going to shove their Johnson up their Anias sideways.